[Monetdb-developers] configure & *_config.h include files

Sjoerd Mullender sjoerd at acm.org
Tue Sep 26 10:27:50 CEST 2006


I think the ideal solution to the problems would be something along the
lines of this:

Projects that use MonetDB should not depend on monetdb_config.h, but
instead in their own configure step figure out what the relevant
parameters are with which MonetDB was compiled.  This means that there
should be a way for those configure scripts to figure this information
out, possibly be including monetdb_config.h in a configure test.

We can still have these other projects share the code base for configure
(i.e. MonetDB's conf/monet.m4), but they should not use the output of a
different run of that code base.

This solution involves figuring out *all* the relevant parameters.  I
can think of some off-hand (sizeof(long), sizeof(oid)), but there may be
more.

On 2006-09-24 21:31, Fabian Groffen wrote:
> This post is OT, but I felt the need to formulate an answer.
> 
> On 24-09-2006 21:01:30 +0200, Jens Teubner wrote:
>> On Sun, Sep 24, 2006 at 03:04:55PM +0200, Fabian Groffen wrote:
>>> ... or make it easier for users and yourself and make it all one
>>> package, where you just do --{enable,disable}-{sql,xquery,...} at the
>>> configure call.  Greatly eases packaging too.
>> No.
> 
> We simply disagree.  Not only we.  But then again, I'm not even
> surprised anymore when people can't get MonetDB to do something useful,
> let alone just use it, because people seem to "on purpose" make it as
> hard as possible to make the system usable from a normal user
> perspective.
> 
> No pun intended.  This is not a personal remark.
> 
> It's just weird that it can be partly done for windows users, but not
> for a much bigger group of our users.
> 
> 
>>  -- I want to spend my development time with programming and *not* with
>>     compiling MonetDB over and over, just because there have been other
> 
> As long as other people commit to your code, this will always be the
> case, no matter how large or small.
> 
>>  -- Pathfinder is a standalone and retargetable compiler.  Most of my
> 
> The part of pathfinder that makes MonetDB/XQuery is a piece that should
> be easily obtainable and usable, to make the pathfinder sources as
> useful as possible to people who are not experienced developers.
> 
>> Throwing all our code into a single big pot would only heal the single
>> symptom that we are currently observing.  Even worse, it would lead to a
>> bigger mess in our code, instead of enforcing discipline and stable,
>> well-designed interfaces.
> 
> Good API/interfacing doesn't seem to be much related to where the code
> is located, but more to who is writing it, IMHO.
> 
>> Other open source projects, by the way, have had to spend a lot of
>> effort to go just the opposite way, from a bloated monolithic project
>> to a nice, modularized software (I'm thinking of the XFree project
>> here).
> 
> (Modular) XOrg is a couple of times bigger than MonetDB.  Sure, I've
> nothing against modularising of code.  But it should not harm the
> usability of the code.  With MonetDB, it is clear to me that the current
> setup greatly harms the general usability of the software, and results
> in all kinds of insane decisions (e.g. MapiClient supports all
> languages and has semantic knowledge on those, while Mserver doesn't
> know anything and needs to be instructed using a sequence of commands in
> order to let it use such language.).
> 
> I believe that for MonetDB's existance in the database world it would be
> good if people (devs) would see the product as a whole.  Ok, I admit
> immediately, that has close to nothing to do with research.
> 
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-- 
Sjoerd Mullender

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